Game of Thrones - Season 5, Episode 8 - "Hardhome"

HBO's "Hardhome"

Paul: Wow. I can't think of another episode of Game of Thrones that so perfectly gave the fans what they wanted, so to speak, and I think I'd be hard-pressed to find a certain "type" of GoT viewer who wasn't satisfied with "Hardhome". The fans of the show's interpersonal politics were treated to extended sequences between Daenerys Stormborn and Tyrion Lannister as she interviewed and then hired him as campaign manager (before the 2016 season heats up). Acting snobs saw more proof as to why Lena Headey deserves a Best Supporting Actress Emmy (at the least). Even fans of the Starks or character development had Sansa finally step up and extract some humanity and answers out of Theon Turnclock. And then everyone else witnessed the Battle of Hardhome.

Perhaps even more impressive were the character moments and touches of humanity within the pure chaos north of the Wall. Wun Wun the Giant and Dolorous Edd getting acquainted. The Thenn's newest Magnar condemning the Crows and then fighting alongside them. Tormund's reluctance to leave the battlefield. And the death of Karsi, a character given the kiss of death of characterization just minutes earlier, by the group of child zombies was legitimately sad and amazing and awful all at the same time. I have no question for you; that was amazing.

Chris:  I couldn't agree more, Mitchell; when Jon Snow was George Washington-ing it up at the front of a row boat with so much time left in the hour, I got the same feeling as way back in season 2 in "Blackwater". Game of Thrones rarely has the time to dwell in any particular location or with particular characters for as long as when something truly world-shattering is going to happen, and the massacre at Hardhome was truly world-shattering.

It was amazingly shot and the location offered the perfect combination of the openness to convey being on the other side of the wall and the claustrophobic feeling once the army of undead was sweeping down the mountainside. I'm also a sucker for Wun Wun and actually thought they had just cut that character out. I can't wait to see him walking around Castle Black.

And as amazing as the action-packed last half of the episode was, the first half was just as gratifying (probably aided not only by Tyrion and Daenerys's interactions but also the focus being on the most compelling story lines). After some sleep, how has your perception of the episode changed (if at all)?

Sansa and Theon

Paul: I need to watch it again, first of all, but secondly, I'm almost fascinated by the overwhelmingly positive response to episode 8. I did just say that "Hardhome" had something for everybody, but this is the Internet we're talking about. The most negative response I've seen thus far was basically a "the end was meh but Dany and Tyrion was awesome." Alan Sepinwall's initial reaction was spot on, as I also initially sat in front of my computer screen for a solid 10 minutes before I could even muster a "Wow" to launch this exercise. It's still tough to remember what happened before we headed north.

Oh, yeah! Lana of the Canals! (Not as alliterative...) Are you optimistic that the goings-on at the House of Black and White could improve in entertainment quality with the introduction of some color, particularly the vibrant environment of Braavos? I'm too bored by her lying-ninja training (and her non-Jaqen new BFF) to look for nuance or metaphor in that part of the story (what was her smirk for when Jaqen flashed the poison?). Also, Tears of Lys or the Strangler?

Cersei's comeuppance achieved the desired result in the room of friends I was watching with - a lot of "Good!"s and "I hate her"s - while I enjoyed picking up the minor details that Maester Qyburn kept dropping. The return of Uncle Kevan should help to stabilize the realm and appease the Tyrells momentarily, and keep us on track for our epilogue scene from "A Dance with Dragons". I kept waiting for Qyburn to offer a trial by combat as another way out of the dungeons, but he teased it well enough before he left.

I'll say this by the end of this season (and with the events at Castle Black and further north): I'm going to be so upset.

Chris: I agree, that was a quick turnaround. It's inevitable when breaking down a series week by week without seeing the whole, but I'm glad it came around.

I was wondering how long we would go before mentioning Arya's new alter-ego. I agree that the "lying-ninja training" has been a bit repetitive, but getting Arya outside and interacting with the people of Braavos did it for me. I could watch another season of Arya applying her new con-man skills across the bustling port city. One thing I was a bit miffed at as a book reader that I can totally get over is that in the books, Faceless Men are pretty much the most expensive wedding gift on the registry. They don't just go around killing for free. I'm totally in on this thread as long as Arya is getting some sunlight.

As for seeing Queen Cersei, like Mr. Sepinwall, I didn't take as much pleasure in her suffering as I was expecting to. Similarly to you, I was grasping at the details about Kevan Lannister's return and Qyburn's progression and was also waiting for the trial by combat, but it made me think: This is probably the first time in the series that we didn't have any direct perspective of the rule of King's Landing, only the rumor and hearsay that helps make the books so deep.

With only two episodes left of the season, I look forward to seeing Kevan at the helm as he navigates the rough waters ahead and hopefully keep the religious fanaticals in check. Also, I noticed in the teaser that we'll be getting the Fighting Pits that we were hoping for, and of course Stannis and his march on Winterfell.

That makes me wonder though. Are audiences going to stay engaged in the Stannis-Bolton war after seeing how imminent and deadly the threat of the White Walkers are? In the books, the weather becomes as much of a villain as either side of the war. I hope the TV show is able to convey that as well.

Paul: Great point to close (and in other spots, obviously). Do we even get a battle between the Boltons and Baratheons? Like you mentioned, in the books our tensions are more contained and psychological than all-out warfare, and let's not forget that through five seasons the Battles of Blackwater, the Wall, and Hardhome are the only such instances we've witnessed. Back when the Starks were still militarily relevant, our frustrations laid with the writers' whole "yadda, yadda" approach to war. I am intrigued by what Ramsay Bolton could do with a unit of 20 men, though, given our winter-y conditions.

Oh yes, the lame Fighting Pits from last week... I am glad that my trepidation last week is of the momentary-variety, and Jorah's suicidal mission will give us a glimpse into Meereen's cultural history. There were a couple of book scenes that I could see Jorah involved with, in place of other deceased or un-cast characters, but I'm not sure if I'm ready to see his end game be that of a walking smallpox blanket (but with Greyscale).

There are two episodes left to the season, but was episode 8 what we would normally expect out of a penultimate hour? What are you hoping to see next week and as we wind down to the GoT offseason, and which stories do you feel have been particularly well-told throughout our fifth season?

Someone's smitten...

Chris: I wondered the same thing about the penultimate hour. Can the show-runners ride this high of momentum through two more hours to close the season? It would be particularly impressive if they could. The scenes we are approaching in the North are some of the most enduring images I have from the entirety of Book 5. I'm very excited to see how that's handled on screen while containing the dose of realism that it likely can't live up to my imagination.

As for the stories that I think have been told well, I feel that goes to both Tyrion's and Dany's. Both storylines were streamlined compared to the books and I think it served the story well. Even though Dany didn't go anywhere and even TV viewers felt the frustration that book readers have had for years about Dany ruling in Meereen, when I look back at the season, some of the best moments were in Meereen.  

And Tyrion's journey from King's Landing to Dany's side actually left us wanting more (Tyrion and Varys in particular) and gave us a glimpse of Valyria. I've been surprised at how effective both stories have been as lean as they are compared to the books.

How about you? What are you excited about as the season comes to a close?

Paul: Fuck it, let's go another round. It was that good of an episode and I haven't even gotten to Hardhome yet on my rewatch.

I was wondering if any of our other storylines were as direct and sequential as Jon Snow's, if only because he embarked on an actual mission. Now that we've seen perhaps the biggest (or at least the most important) event at the end of episode 8, how do we close the season? Can anything compare, and do the writers even try, or are we left with more intimate and character-oriented options to wind down the last two hours? Ser Jorah should have his last moment of glory in the big arena and should again give us a sense of spectacle, plus whatever Stannis has planned for a siege on Winterfell (because Roose Bolton obviously doesn't know his Westerosi history if he thinks Stannis Baratheon can be waited-out and starved into submission, even with some snow flakes).

A week ago I pined for the return of the epic scope to our story, with our worlds simultaneously expanding and coming together. "Hardhome" delivered completely, and pushed our boundaries and expectations of action sequences, conflict, and mythology in our universe, with still two episodes left. I would question if we ever see a sequence as massive as this again, but I think a part of "Hardhome" was to subvert our expectations and keep us from waiting on the fireworks in the second-to-last episode.

Which is all to say that I think we finish pretty subdued this season compared to the last half of episode 8. Cersei's trial probably won't be as entertaining as Tyrion's, due to the Charles Dance-to-Jonathan Pryce drop-off in sarcasm and showmanship, but Lena Headey should at least be given a chance to punch it into the endzone for the touchdown, after marching down the field ("it" being her Emmy). Like I said last week, I'm still waiting on a Doran Martell monologue to save this season in Dorne, and we could get it next week if the previews are accurate. Sansa and Brienne have to run into each other again eventually, right? I can finally say that as a book reader, I have no idea what is coming next in some of these arcs, which made the Battle at Hardhome that much more incredible, as I kept waiting for it to end early even though I knew the episode would run long. Does Arya finally stumble upon Ser Meryn Trant and the Lord Oaf of Highgarden on the docks of Braavos (after she's won her poison prize, of course)?

I don't quite share your fond memories of Meereen this season, but how do you think Daenerys's season ends, and do they begin next season still in Meereen? Would you be as content as I would with just Tyrion and Dany sipping wine on the pyramid terrace and discussing political strategy for the last two hours? And, probably because of their partnership, has this been the most quotable episode of the show in recent memory?

Chris: Without getting into spoiler territory, I wonder how they end Dany's season as well. There's a very familiar scene to close Book 5 for her that doesn't seem to involve Tyrion; I wonder if some variation of that is used to close out the season and I wonder where Tyrion goes from here. I worry that he's becoming too much of the fan favorite (isn't he supposed to be in despair after just killing his own father and lover)? There's got to be a dark/bad side to this. There has to be some conflict. As much as I share your fascination with "Tyrion and Dany sipping wine on the pyramid terrace" there's got to be some higher stakes at play eventually, as quotable as that may be.

I like your theory about Arya (or Lana) stumbling upon Ser Meryn Trant. That'd be a tidy way of bringing Arya back into the world we know a bit. I'm excited to see where that storyline goes as, like you said, there's not much source material left to cover, and like you, I'll be waiting on that Doran Martell plea for relevance.

But to me the momentum of the end of the season rests on two key places, King's Landing and Castle Black. In King's Landing, how Cersei and Margery are handled by the High Sparrow, the potential trials, and the revelation of Qyburn's science project should be plenty do dive into in two episodes. In Castle Black, I'm concerned I know where this story is going and Jon Snow's return with the Wildlings (and after that mess that was Hardhome) will be the most interesting storyline to close the season. That's what I'm excited about.